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razor



Joined: 21 Dec 2005
Posts: 26
PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 2:38 pm    Post subject: Tell me your thinking Reply with quote

Greetings. I'm looking for a mental checklist of things to go through once the hand is on the turn or river. For instance:

1. Replay hands, bets, raises up until that point.
2. Use the flop, bets and raises, try to put your opponent on a hand.
3. Calculate pot odds.
4. Calculate your outs, and based on #2, your opponents outs.
5. Make a decision.

Forgive me if my newness is showing but I'm a technician and need checklisted structure to machine through the hands. My style of limited play.

Instead of picking my guessed at order apart, tell me your thinking. Thanks in advance.
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pritz



Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Posts: 31
PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1. Am I in the lead?
2. Can I win without a showdown?
3. Does the pot odds make calling a draw profitable?

If I think I'm in the lead, I will decide to check-raise the turn or not. You would try it against an aggressive player more than a solid one, because the solid one will sometimes fold a good hand and may not bet the turn. If I bet out on the turn and get raised, I will sometimes fold a one pair hand if I think I'm beat depending on the size of the pot and who raised. I will normally always call down with 2 pair or better and will reraise will my best hands and once in a blue moon I will bluff 3-bet the turn.

If I'm not in the lead, I might try a bluff-raise against a solid player or someone who bluffs too much, but only a small percent of the time(10-25%) and when I have outs. Most of your other opponents are too dumb to ever fold, so you check your pot odds and hope to draw out. If you aren't sure you are ahead, you can bet out and fold to a raise. You can also bet out with your draws if you don't have the pot odds to call. Sometimes just being the first one to bet the turn will be profitable.
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lork



Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 36
PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something to factor into your list. ??How many people are willing to see the turn, and especially the river, and why are all these people in the pot???

I'm starting to lay down hands that I wouldn't lay down a few weeks ago for this one reason, and the account balance is going up and the downswings aren't so steep as they used to be.

I think the number of people contesting the pot, while probably not quantifiable, is bigger that we might think.
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DeepBlue



Joined: 19 Dec 2005
Posts: 121
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My biggest worry is number of people seeing the flop - Your checklist is fine, but that's more suited to a head to head at the river. If you've still got callers in the game then you need to consider the likelihood that you are in fact in the lead.

You should also, as pritz implied, decide whether the money in the pot is worth continuing for. If you're playing in the hope of catching a card at the turn or the river, a rich pot and your number of hits decreasing you should consider folding there, too, before you proceed.

Good luck, they are good habits to get into.
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